Re: The CGI Thread

It's not about making it easy for myself. You have no idea how mutch I practiced in CGI.
But I don't like how you are being such an !@#$%^& in a way of not helping anything.
the Brickfilmers community is mostly based on learning/helping eachother and that's what makes it populair.
CGI is not populair because it's more difficult, and the people who are good at it, are making a complete fool out of themselves by saying ''I'm not helping anyone, they need to suffer'' which is in my opinion complete crap.

Once I'm good at CGI, I WILL gonna help people, I WILL gonna do CGI for other people.
Just think about it.

''You don't have to tell him how great is coffee is man!''

Re: The CGI Thread

Lechnology wrote:
vik wrote:
Lechnology wrote:

You're not helping people learn if you're doing the work for them.

Why wouldn't he be learning if he does the effects for people .. ?

Read it again.  Think about it: You need help writing an essay.  Am I helping by giving you a completed essay that I spent time researching for, formatting, making the proper citations, etc. for you to hand in?

That's stupid.
Not everyone has CGI programs, so not everyone is able to do it for one another thing is some people are just not good at it. I think I'd suck at CGI. And in real movies it's not like 1 person does everything, there's a composer effects persons and stff. Probably more than 100 people working on a film. And what if you need a composer, and he tells you you should do it yourself because you have to learn ...:/

Re: The CGI Thread

Last time I checked brickfilms are not real movies.. I do agree with you though. If someone wants someone to do effects for them, and the other one agrees, then why wouldn't he do the effect for that guy? People may not want to learn it either.

Re: The CGI Thread

vik wrote:
Lechnology wrote:
vik wrote:

Why wouldn't he be learning if he does the effects for people .. ?

Read it again.  Think about it: You need help writing an essay.  Am I helping by giving you a completed essay that I spent time researching for, formatting, making the proper citations, etc. for you to hand in?

That's stupid.
Not everyone has CGI programs, so not everyone is able to do it.

Blender, free, go download it.  Countless tutorials, go find them.

T.G-Tom wrote:

But I don't like how you are being such an !@#$%^& in a way of not helping anything.

You're comparing doing effects for someone (which I also have done) who can't afford/find the software to do it themselves (including music) to providing a basic part of computer animation that there are tutorials for and a person can learn to build it on their own.  It's not my problem if people are skipping essential steps to get to the advanced stuff (jumping to rigging a minifig when they haven't learned how to create mesh objects yet, or building a simple rig first before going into more sophisticated designs.  Giving the rigs away will not help you learn.

T.G-Tom wrote:

Once I'm good at CGI, I WILL [...] help people, I WILL [...] do CGI for other people.

Now that is stupid.

Perhaps using the Four Noble Truths about suffering isn't the best analogy, let's try: "Give a man a fish and you feed him for a day. Teach a man to fish and you feed him for a lifetime."

Better if you taught people how to do CGI rather than doing the work for them.  Doing the effects for people because they don't have the tools to do it is fine.  You don't know how to duplicate a key, get a key maker to do it.  Doing the CGI for people when they themselves have the tools to do CGI (Blender, free) is not fine.

If you figured out rigging and you don't think it works, then I'll show you my rig if you think it will help.

Lastly, experience.  You learn better through experience.  You won't learn which rigging works better for a minifig, what weight maps are for, fixing normals and what the hell is a normal, etc. without experimenting.

Last edited by Lechnology (April 11, 2010 (02:33pm))

https://i.imgur.com/4b9NnS3.pnghttps://i.imgur.com/GUIl0qk.pnghttps://i.imgur.com/ox64uld.pnghttps://i.imgur.com/v3iyhE5.png

Re: The CGI Thread

You do have some fine points Lechnology. Do you reckon maybe you could do a tutorial that is specifically based around rigs that can be used for Lego men? Because you seem to know exactly what you're doing.

Formerly BrikProductions 
Brik Productions Website / The Flame War Forum
http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash1/hs493.ash1/26958_1114276633250_1716982862_207471_7119801_n.jpg

Re: The CGI Thread

I actually don't need a rig anymore Lech, because while you and T.G were debating, I made my own. I think I had an idea to make it when James said that he just lines up the 3D view as best he could, so I know there wasn't really a secret trick. mini/wink

Also, how is it disadvantaging people to give them the rig? They would still have to learn to use it, and become effective at it (Plus actually make it again on a different minifig, because they probably wouldn't just use the one minifig that you would send them. They would still have to do an intensive amount of work to master it.

Last edited by BGanimations (April 12, 2010 (05:02am))

http://www.majhost.com/gallery/BGanimations/Signatures/final_400x100.png

Re: The CGI Thread

Lechnology, you're now pretending to have some good points but you blatantly ignored everything I said, except for me saying not everyone has CGI programs.
I guess Peter Jackson, Tarantino, the Coen brothers should do everything themselves huh ! Doing effects, composing music, editing. Everything themselves

Last edited by Pillow (April 12, 2010 (05:03am))

Re: The CGI Thread

BGanimations wrote:

Also, how is it disadvantaging people to give them the rig? They would still have to learn to use it, and become effective at it (Plus actually make it again on a different minifig, because they probably wouldn't just use the one minifig that you would send them. They would still have to do an intensive amount of work to master it.

There are rigs out there that you can download and play with. I think I linked to the man candy DVD, that is an amazing rig for sure and it is offered for free. But you should always build your own rig. Figuring out how to build it and how to weight paint are skills you'll need again if your serious about it.

http://www.majhost.com/gallery/jamit/LAMLradioEps/sig.gifhttp://www.majhost.com/gallery/jamit/LAMLradioEps/sig2.gif

Re: The CGI Thread

Ludvig wrote:

Last time I checked brickfilms are not real movies.

mini/blankexpression

You're going to offend a huge percentage of this site by saying that.

Re: The CGI Thread

Ludvig wrote:

Last time I checked brickfilms are not real movies.. I do agree with you though. If someone wants someone to do effects for them, and the other one agrees, then why wouldn't he do the effect for that guy? People may not want to learn it either.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Movie
"Film encompasses individual motion pictures, the field of film as an art form, and the motion picture industry. Films (also referred to as movies or motion pictures) are produced by recording photographic images with cameras, or by creating images using animation techniques or visual effects."

I'm going to guess you mean feature length films released in theatres?

Re: The CGI Thread

vik wrote:

Lechnology, you're now pretending to have some good points but you blatantly ignored everything I said, except for me saying not everyone has CGI programs.
I guess Peter Jackson, Tarantino, the Coen brothers should do everything themselves huh ! Doing effects, composing music, editing. Everything themselves

How am I ignoring what you're saying?

Lechnology wrote:

You're comparing doing effects for someone (which I also have done) who can't afford/find the software to do it themselves (including music) to providing a basic part of computer animation that there are tutorials for and a person can learn to build it on their own.

[...]

Doing the effects for people because they don't have the tools to do it is fine.  You don't know how to duplicate a key, get a key maker to do it.  Doing the CGI for people when they themselves have the tools to do CGI (Blender, free) is not fine.

You're talking about multiple people contributing to a single film project.  Community projects, in other words.  FYI, former Community Projects moderator here (great ideas thrown around, great discussions, no results, unfortunately).  Teamwork is acceptable, obviously.  What I am talking about is in regards to learning CGI.  If you don't intend to learn CGI and just want someone to cover parts of your film with CGI, then that's between you and the person you're asking.  I've done it for Sprinkles.  But if you're learning CGI and intend to animate in CGI, then it is in my opinion better if you learn hands on and through tutorials.  My point of view is that if I give you an essential part of CGI brickfilm animation (the minifig rig), I'm afraid I'd rob you of your learning experience.  As James W puts it: "you should always build your own rig. Figuring out how to build it and how to weight paint are skills you'll need again if your serious about it."  It is my opinion, though, not the law.

Let me put it another way: Prime Directive.  My prime directive is that I will not intervene in your learning process until you've learned the basics.

But should this CGI brickfilm trend become more popular, I'll certainly contribute.

To reiterate: You're talking about contributing to one person's film, I'm talking about interfering with the learning process.

By the way, rookie riggers, how goes rigging the hands?  The minifig hands have such an arbitrary axis of rotation, it takes time to get it just right.  Let me know if you're having trouble.

Of course, if you're going with the flexible outside-the-minifig-box arms, then you can avoid the arbitrary axis entirely.

Last edited by Lechnology (April 12, 2010 (12:53pm))

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Re: The CGI Thread

I thought you were saying EVERYONE should learn CGI and do it themselves, even though they aren't planning on learning CGI. Now I understand what you mean, sorry about the confusion.

Re: The CGI Thread

My apologies for causing it mini/wink

https://i.imgur.com/4b9NnS3.pnghttps://i.imgur.com/GUIl0qk.pnghttps://i.imgur.com/ox64uld.pnghttps://i.imgur.com/v3iyhE5.png

Re: The CGI Thread

Here is a quick look at our WIP LEGO landscape we are working on in Carrara:

http://www.brickshelf.com/gallery/BuilderBrothers/MOCs/forest.jpg

http://www.brickshelf.com/gallery/BuilderBrothers/signatures/thac14sig.png

Re: The CGI Thread

Let me guess, a pixelated terrain map was used?  Why do I get the feeling that Q*bert is going to jump into the scene at any moment...

https://i.imgur.com/4b9NnS3.pnghttps://i.imgur.com/GUIl0qk.pnghttps://i.imgur.com/ox64uld.pnghttps://i.imgur.com/v3iyhE5.png

Re: The CGI Thread

It looks good, but the only thing is that it looks like a place from Marioland or something. Plus the fact that there's no studs and they're not perfectly rectangular, each brick seems slightly sloped inwards. Other than that, I like it though. I like the sky backdrop (it fits nicely), and I also like the sun.

http://www.majhost.com/gallery/BGanimations/Signatures/final_400x100.png

Re: The CGI Thread

@Lechnology - Yes, it was a pixelated terrain map.  We don't know who Q*bert is though...

@BGanimations - We see your point, and we will try to fix this.  It is actually supposed to be the setting for a castle animation, but we suppose it does, in a way, resemble Marioland.

http://www.brickshelf.com/gallery/BuilderBrothers/signatures/thac14sig.png

Re: The CGI Thread

The Sun isn't right. If the Sun was in that position the light would likely have a different tone and completely different shadows would be produced. That shot looks like its mid-day.

http://www.majhost.com/gallery/jamit/LAMLradioEps/sig.gifhttp://www.majhost.com/gallery/jamit/LAMLradioEps/sig2.gif

Re: The CGI Thread

If I may make a suggestion, it might be better to change the title of the thread to "The CGI Thread" (without the quotes of course), because it seems like there's a lot of things like people posting their CGI stuff and getting it critiqued, along with some questions and comments in general. Not saying this is a bad thing though, I like the direction this thread is going. mini/bigsmile

http://www.majhost.com/gallery/BGanimations/Signatures/final_400x100.png

Re: The CGI Thread

@James W. - Your right, the sun is in the wrong place.  We will have to change that...

@BGanimations - Good idea.  The thread name is now changed...  mini/smile

EDIT: Here is a modified version of the landscape (still needs work though) -

http://www.brickshelf.com/gallery/BuilderBrothers/MOCs/forest2.jpg

Last edited by BuilderBrothers (April 14, 2010 (07:30am))

http://www.brickshelf.com/gallery/BuilderBrothers/signatures/thac14sig.png