Topic: Small dillemma - moving bricks

I finally got my PC back and I started shooting my Star Wars Parody (yay) but I discovered a small problem.

I'm shooting on a grey base plate - the thin type - as my setting is on a spaceship.  I've never used this base plate before but I've discovered its so thin, it bounces on just about every frame as it flexes each time I move the models.

Even the smallest minifig movement (raising a hand) flexes the thin base plate, makes the whole set move just a tiny bit and looks like I bumped the camera.

I've tried using sticky tack directly under the plate so the figs are directly over it, tape, no tack - no tape.  Using the corner of the plate.  The centre.  No luck.  mini/sad

The middle and wide shots are okay - there is flex but you don't notice it on a wide angle.  I have close up over-the-shoulder dialogue scenes and its the zoomed in angles that pick up the flex.

mini/sad

I'm going to have to rethink my base plate or re-think those close ups.  Lucky for me, I discovered this on the very first set/shoot!

Aka Fox
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Best brick films: My selection

Re: Small dillemma - moving bricks

I believe some animators like David Pagano of Paganomation prefer using spring clamps to hold down their baseplates.

Do you have a picture of your set or studio? Maybe the baseplate flexes so much because there isn't much built on the baseplate to weigh it down.

Re: Small dillemma - moving bricks

I use my whopping great grey baseplate frequently, or I did up until March (certain projects need certain bases) and I normally just blu-tacked it to my desk, but with either 9 or 12 globs of blu-tack: one in each corner, one between each corner, one in the very centre of the baseplate, and occasionally one halfway across the radius from the centre to edge on the left and right sides. Hope that makes sense. It's not a totally perfect system but it worked for me for a good long time.

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Re: Small dillemma - moving bricks

I never animate directly on baseplates anymore.  It's not a very good way to go.

Instead, try building on top of the base plates with plates and bricks and such.

Re: Small dillemma - moving bricks

I do the same as Squid. I build almost all of my sets on "stilts." This allows me to raise and lower the set as I desire, allowing for greater flexibility with camera angles. All of the bricks and plates on the baseplates helps stiffen and weigh everything down.

Of course, this method requires a substantial number of plates if you are building a big set.

Re: Small dillemma - moving bricks

Nathan Wells wrote:

I do the same as Squid. I build almost all of my sets on "stilts." This allows me to raise and lower the set as I desire, allowing for greater flexibility with camera angles. All of the bricks and plates on the baseplates helps stiffen and weigh everything down.

Of course, this method requires a substantial number of plates if you are building a big set.

I do the same. I have found that it helps a lot.

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Re: Small dillemma - moving bricks

Building a floor instead of using a baseplate is definitely the way to go, as the studs on baseplates a bit more loose than on bricks. However, not everyone has a collection of LEGO large enough to do so. Only recently have I been able to start building floors, and even now it's not every film. The flex problem is a result of mistreatment of the baseblate, and is a common problem if they aren't stored well. Sometimes they just get old and aren't really useful. Unfortunately you may just have to buy a new one; or start investing in a lot of gray bricks.

Re: Small dillemma - moving bricks

Thanks for the tips.  I have a reasonably large set and i have a few wide shots and a long pan that would seriously tax my grey block collection.  mini/sad

Options:

Continue tacking until the flexing stops;
Try a different plate to see if they are all "warped" (i have 4 plates);
Use a false floor as suggested and redo my storyboard with this limited floor space in mind;
Use a green base plate (thick) mini/confused
Dont use any plate and set up directly on my desk;

Ill think this one over.  Hopefully option 2 works straight off.

Aka Fox
Youtube: My channel   Twitter: @animationantics
Best brick films: My selection

Re: Small dillemma - moving bricks

I use the large baseplate all the time, and while I have run into that "bouncing" issue on occasion, it isn't that hard to fix. One solution is to weigh down the baseplate with big heavy walls/props, another is to just weigh it down out of the camera's view so you get the still baseplate but still an open room. Sometimes the bouncing tends to go right back to the same place, and you can just ignore the odd feeling while your moving stuff, as it'll all look the same in-camera.

Re: Small dillemma - moving bricks

To add on to what Pritchard said, if you have some couple-pound weights to weight down the baseplate (I occasionally use a pair of 3 pound weights). However, I normally use bricks or plates to build on the baseplate (what ANP said). The final possibility I've previously used is tape, although that can sometimes have some wiggle room still.

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Re: Small dillemma - moving bricks

Generally what I do when I use a larger baseplate that does that, is to put blutack in a few places underneath the baseplate (like Jampot said) and then tape the edges with packing tape, just a nice big piece running diagonally across each corner.  Never had any problems with that. 
My last film I actually combined those two and THEN built the set one brick above baseplate level.  Set didn't wiggle at all and I had the freedom to shoot lower than usual, I thought that really made a difference in the film.

Re: Small dillemma - moving bricks

Thanks for all the tips guys - I'm trying each suggestion one by one.  I tried the tack but I used too much and I had dips and valleys all over my plate - I used too much so it actually made the bounce worse.

I tried using two cans of soup to weigh down the plate.  That had some success but I then had the challenge of maneuvoring around these large tins of soup.  I used a bag of sugar - that actually provided a hand rest for me when doing fine movement.  I'm going to consider something similar in a permanent way.  mini/smile  I think a bag of rice or sand (that doesn't leak might make a great hand rest when doing fine head/hand movements.

Anyway - I then changed to two different base plates.  Here is what I got*:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/umms5fx0deiby … ttesta.avi

* shot during day, curtains open only one lamp on, put on a loop.

If you ignore the light flicker and focus on the background, there is a minor amount of bounce.  I'ts mostly noticable when the loop jumps from the end to the beginning.  My real vid won't loop - so I'm hoping that most noticable bounce won't actually happen for real.

I think I can do better with small amounts of tape and securing the camera a little bit more.

Aka Fox
Youtube: My channel   Twitter: @animationantics
Best brick films: My selection

Re: Small dillemma - moving bricks

Okay - I'm happy I have this nailed.  I'd like to introduce to you - for the first time - Jake (no sound):

https://www.dropbox.com/s/qpco22wrpyc1rxt/MeetJake.avi

Jake is Chloe's side kick and sets up all the great punchlines for Chloe to deliver.  My main character is Chloe - a girl and I'll introduce her next.  Anyway - say hi to Jake. 

(notice no camera/set movement.  29.97 fps)  mini/bigsmile


Edit:  And here's Chloe - again - shot during day but I noticed a big change in brightness.  I think that was more me messing with the camera settings than anything else.  Mental note to not do that next time!

Chloe is the lead actress.  Feminine but can handle herself.  Athletic and sharp.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/2q71wco7ldxclik/MeetChloe.avi

(still no set wobble)

Last edited by togfox (May 31, 2014 (08:05pm))

Aka Fox
Youtube: My channel   Twitter: @animationantics
Best brick films: My selection