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Forums - Bricks in Motion » General Film Discussion » The Doctor Who Discussion thread(SPOILER ALERT!)
I've recently got into Dr Who a bit, so may as well join the conversation. I thought the same as your spoiler Cartoonkid. They would link together.
The episode was interesting, as Brickyman said, it depends how they wrap it up. The monsters were quite good I thought, I mean they used to look really fake back a few years ago (I was watching some of the David Tennant episodes on the other channels). I look forward to seeing it next week.
According to the internet, the monsters are called
Silents (1=Silent 2=Silents Species=Silence (I guess))
which gives a whole new meaning to "silence will fall".
All right I just saw it today with my friends, I have to say that I am really impressed with this episode.
I loved every single moment of it! I am really surprised Moffat could top his other episode with an OPENING episode with so much humor and creepyness! I like the fact that the silence wasn't in alot of the episode so they stay as a mystery until the next episode. Matt is still my favorite Doctor and that really shows in this episode, he is the best at being an old weak Doctor and young at the same time and you can really see that he is not a human which the Doctor should.
Amy was brilliant as she always have been together with Rory. I liked River alot more in this episode then I have (I didn't know that was possible!?), she really showed that she has seen worser days.
Overall, I LOVE THIS EPISODE! Every single bit of it! Perfect episode but I recommend you watch some older ones before watching this.
11/10
Yes, the only part I hated about this episode was that it had to end.
Haha.
People really seem to like this one. I didn't DISLIKE it, but I guess I'll have to watch it again to understand..
I don't have the BBC channel where I live so I'm renting them on iTunes. I just saw the prequel and it freaked me out so the series has to be good! I haven't seen the series before and I'm downloading it right now! I can't wait!
I'm sorry for the double post but I want some things explained:
Is this the last season?
Why is everything happening so fast?
Did Amy actually shoot the astronaut kid?
Doctor's death and consequences I don't quite understand. Could I get and explanation?
To answer your questions in order:
Probably not
I don't see what you mean. It might be because of the new layout of the episodes. 6/7 now and 6/7 later
Supposedly
He got shot and shot again before he regenerated and you can't tell the past version of someone what will happen in the future otherwise bad stuff happens.
Quite a lot of the questions will be answered next episode.
Last edited by KobbleThePenguin (April 27, 2011 (09:59am))
This episode was pretty good - far better than 70% of Series 5, and a huge improvement over the DISMAL Christmas Special.
The main problem is that the Christmas Special raped the laws of time and space. Whilst it would still be stupid if Moffat continued with view that time can in fact be changed (like in 'Back to the Future'), he suddenly must have realised what a doofus he has been - so now time in fact CANNOT be changed. Whilst I admire him reverting back to the previously established laws...IT MAKES NO SENSE!! Why has time and space COMPLETELY CHANGED!?!? TWICE!!! He's not even consistent WITH HIS OWN WRITING!!!
Anyways: we open with the Doctor.....naked. One of the many things I do NOT want to see before I die. But its OK, according to the Comic Relief Special: He's a pervert now - so he just hides in a woman's dress. Oh, and the woman name-drops by saying "Doctor? Doctor Who?"
That is the stupidest pre-credit line since the Christmas Special. Oh, but the name-dropping doesn't stop there! In case you didn't facepalm the first time, the not-American Agent says it again! Well, if at first you fail....fail again!
Oh yeah, and the Doctor dies. This WOULD be really shocking if you didn't try and make it really suspenseful and tear-jerking on the very first episode. And its pretty obvious this isn't going to be the last season, because 1. The Doctor has at least one more regeneration to go - although Moffat will probably pull something out of his butt to make him last longer and 2. We are only on Series 2 (but I still call it 6 because it didn't re-start when Eccleston left, did it? And its really confusing considering the REAL Series 2 was only 5 years ago).
So, because of the violation to the laws of time: I was pretty much yelling throughout the whole thing: "JUST TELL HIM HE'S GOING TO DIE!!" But, according to River Exposition Song, that would cause the universe to implode. Oh, so NOW the universe would end!
And, I know everyone is saying that the monsters are terrifying....but I think they are hilarious. Seriously? Your going with the suits? Do Aliens have a 'Topman'? Did they have to travel to earth just to buy them? Did they order online, or did they just walk into a store? (Then again, they have the Obliviate Charm, so why not?) They look like a mutated Robert Palmer! And, when they kill they turn into a Dementor and shoot lightning which looks like it was drawn on MS Paint. Thats hilarious, not to mention that I hated the not-American Women right from the first sight. According to Moffat: everyone in America is dumber than the Doctor Who writers and more trigger-happy than the military troops from 'Avatar'.
Oh, and Moffat: Scary does not mean that monster just jump out of nowhere and kill you. You need actual threat. The concept of the Obilivate charm is pretty cool, but its never explored to its full potential. Wouldn't it have been better if Amy was trying to warn the not-American that the mutant Robert Palmer was behind her, but Amy kept forgetting what she was talking about - or vice-versa? What if they walked into the office and killed one of the security officers, then made everyone forget about it - meaning they became suspicious of each-over? The whole forgetting thing is really kinda pointless - since the Doctor doesn't listen to Amy anyway (surely, from experience you would WANT to listen to your companion. I mean, how many times has it saved you in the past?)
And, cant you just get American Actors? Not one 'American' sounded convincing. It sounded like an amateur dramatics production. Is it really so hard to get an actual American? By the looks of it, at least two scenes were actually shot in America...why didn't you do a casting call whilst over there?
Rory and River Song go exploring in some caves underneath the building, where an army of evil monster are lurking. Aaargh! Its the Stone Angel Two-Parter again!! Quick! Find a switch to flick!!! Beware the incredibly slow moving Angels who can move when they are made of stone!!
And then they go into a room to find...um....the space-ship from 'The Lodger'? Production Design Department: Are you even trying? Did some sketches from Series 5 accidentally get muddled up with the new designs?
And then....the episode ends. Huh. Interesting. There are some things that are not explained, but I'm guessing all will be revealed. As I said, this episode was pretty good. Its only really because of the dire Christmas Special that there are confusions. I admire Moffat for changing back to the 'time is already written out' method - and it means I'm curious to see what will happen regarding the Doctors 'death', although its probably just going to be the Doctor pulling a solution out of his a$$. Its kinda like how we know River Song was going to survive because we've already seen her death. But I applaud Moffat for being daring and deviating from the formula RTD laid out. Really, despite my nitpicks, I'm actually looking forward to the rest of the series....its just a shame the Mutant Robert Palmer's are so crap....
Last edited by Max Butcher (April 27, 2011 (11:36am))
Thanks! You two made it a lot clearer.
Oh, and how did River Song get to 1968? It was later in her life-time when she got the time-jumping-thing. And why doesn't she have higher security if she can escape easier than MaGyver?
Oh, and how did River Song get to 1968? It was later in her life-time
You answered your own question.
This is the River Song from 1968. We STILL don't know her past, so who knows when and where she was born? It's possible she would be 35-45 however old she is, whe Earth is still in 1968.
And as for the escaping thing, I don't know. MAybe she wants to be locked up because of the guilt, but makes sure it's easy to escape for the Doctor?
I haven't fully watched the episode yet, but River Song and her ease of escape is more of a running gag than a serious plot thread, it would seem. It made me laugh, at least.
This is the River Song from 1968.
What, so she waited for minus 1000 years after she escaped the futuristic prison? She doesn't have the time jumping thing - she gets that when the pandorica opened (which is later in her lifetime, meaning she cannot possibly have it now), so how did she get all the way back to America 1968 when the prison was far in the future and IN FREAKING SPACE!!!
I'm personally getting quite sick of River Song. She's a good character, but is SO overused. Why doesn't she just marry him already! Why doesn't she just become a full-time companion!? Sure, she's relevant to this episode - since she kinda needs to be there - but what about the others? Did she add ANYTHING to the pandorica two-parter, apart from removing all suspense? And she did NOTHING in the Stone Angels Two-Parter. NOTHING!! She was interesting when introduced again in the Stone Angels double feature of crap - but my interest has long gone.
Last edited by Max Butcher (April 28, 2011 (09:46am))
The Doctor has at least one more regeneration to go - although Moffat will probably pull something out of his butt to make him last longer.
And then they go into a room to find...um....the space-ship from 'The Lodger'? Production Design Department: Are you even trying? Did some sketches from Series 5 accidentally get muddled up with the new designs?
If you mean that the Doctor can only regenerate one more time then you are wrong, in SJA in the episode he appeared in he said he can regenerate limitless times because the timelords are gone and cannot restrict him. If you mean they are only going to make 1 more series, I doubt it.
The space-ship thing from 'The Lodger' is probably the same one. In 'The Lodger' they don't say much about where it came from so they are just showing you and will elaborate on it in the next one. Otherwise, you are probably right.
And they will probably find a way to get the Doctor out of dying. If they were gonna full-on kill him, they wouldn't do it on the first episode.
I also have to agree that River is becoming a bit overused.
If you mean that the Doctor can only regenerate one more time then you are wrong, in SJA in the episode he appeared in he said he can regenerate limitless times because the timelords are gone and cannot restrict him.
Aha! I knew they would come up with something! Although, that actually is a pretty good reason....
Yeah, I didn't watch much of the SJA - but what I DID watch was surprisingly good.
Just saw the next episode of Doctor Who! 
To be honest, not many questions were answered.
It does prove that the Lodger TARDIS is the same type.
It had an interesting (or confusing) start, a revealing (or confusing) middle and a exciting (or confusing) end!
All in all it was great! (Or confusing)
I don't think I've posted this before.
I'm pretty sure that's what all Doctor Who fans are like 
Oh, and how did River Song get to 1968? It was later in her life-time when she got the time-jumping-thing. And why doesn't she have higher security if she can escape easier than MaGyver?
Her future is the Doctors past. So it's most likely a later life version of her.
Wow. Y'know; I didn't expect the second part to actually be BETTER. But there you have it.
The whole sequence within the Orphanage was better than the entire of Series 5. My only wish was that the entire episode was based around it. But noooo...
I'm just going to say it: the scenes with Nixon were INTOLERABLE. I was, no jokes, watching this guy through my fingers. He is not President Nixon - he looks nothing like Nixon, he sounds nothing like Nixon. If it wasn't for the fact they called him Nixon, I would be wondering why they had let a terrible actor on set.
Moffat clearly has never been to America. This whole two parter is insulting to Americans. On behalf of England: I apologise. I complain that America stereotypes us as tea-drinking snobs, but Moffat stereotypes Americans as over-patriotic a$$holes. Every time Nixon walks into a room, we get that bloody fanfare and everyone is like "GOD BLESS AMERICA!!" and Nixon is like "DO THIS FOR YOUR COUNTRY!!" and I'm like: "MOFFAT YOU IDIOT!!". And WHY do we even need to see the President? What is the relevance of the scenes with the President? Did we really need that scene where he was captured only to be released by the President? What did it contribute - apart from being one of the most insulting things I have ever seen in my life! And I sat through 'Batman and Robin'!
What makes it more insulting is that the episode could have been fantastic. The premise is there, there are some really good scenes, there are some really interesting sub-plots. Yet, its stuff like this that reminds me why I hated every Moffat-Written Episode of Series 5.
The opening is a mess. Moffat tries to be edgy and open up a two parter by cutting to several months later. Yep, that brilliant twist where Amy shoots the girl...just brushed aside. All we get is a really brief flashback showing them running. We then cut to Amy running from some Land-Rovers (which is stupid, since they would have caught up with her in about five seconds), in..Utah? But is cornered by a terrifying FEW FEET DROP!! Which is stupid, since she could literally just jump down and be fine.
We then go to River...in New York? Wow, that jump in time and location was so abrupt I got whiplash. She predictably jumps off the Empire State building....because she pretty much knows that Moffat will pull something out of his butt. I love how even the characters are aware that they are aided with the power of plot convenience.
Then we cut to Rory...in Arizona (I think, I cant remember that well)? STOP JUMPING AROUND!! I have no time to take in what has happened before we jump to a completely different event in a completely different location.
And we cut to a secret military base. STOP IT!! And, it turns out that the evil FBI agent was working for them all this time!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kdhhQhqi_AE
Wait...that makes no sense. Why did he need to pretend that they were against them? If the Doctor has permission from THE FREAKING PRESIDENT then surely he doesn't need to work 'undercover'! Why did they even capture him if the President (and no doubt the secret service) knows he is friendly!?! They are LEGALLY ALLOWED to investigate!! Do you realise the amount of time and effort saved if you just ran off and searched straight away?? The whole 'undercover' sub-plot is, like most things in this episode, POINTLESS!!!
And....your not going to believe this...all these events take place BEFORE THE EPISODE HAS BEGUN!!! This is all a pre-credit sequence! This has got to be the worst opening ever. Its so rushed, so jumpy, and so pointless! I was expecting an Edgar Wright transition in between each sequence - only 'Spaced' and 'The Three Flavours of Cornetto Trilogy' were not a SF Television serial! They were comedies and the fast pacing adds to the humour! This just confused me! Sure, its sort of explained later, but I actually had to re-wind (thank god for Sky+) and watch it again because I had no idea what just happened. The good and consistent pacing of the previous episode...GONE! And straight after the credits, the episode slows down again. Its like Moffat thought "Oh crap! How am I supposed to show all that! Well, I could just remove the undercover sub-plot because...well....it doesn't make any sense, but I can instead condense it all into 5 mins! GENIUS!!"
Oh yeah, and that scene where Amy takes a picture of the Alien on her phone....POINTLESS!! We never see the picture again!
And, as it turns out, that WAS the ship from 'The Lodger'. Yeah....I just lost 100 credibility points. But, to be fair, it just a throwaway gag. What is the relevance of it being the ship from the Lodger? Is it really so important? Did the events of this episode have any impact within 'The Lodger'? POINTLESS!!
However, as I said, the sequence in the orphanage was outstanding. The narrative changes to where we see the story from the characters perspective - and whenever the Mutant Robert Palmers attack (THEY ARE NOT SCARY!! THEY ARE HILARIOUS!!), we dont see it, but we discover and notice the loss of time and memory. Its difficult to explain, but its nothing short of genius. Honestly: wouldn't this two-parter be so much better if the whole thing was done like this? I think Moffat missed a brilliant opportunity here to be really creative.
Really, if the whole thing was like that sequence, this would have been brilliant. As it stands, its just good. Its better than the first part, but the opening lets it down.
Oh, and its hinted that Amy is pregnant with the Doctors baby. Ew. Thats something out of perverted fanfiction - not a serious story arc. Also, I'm just imagining parents having to try and explain how Amy became pregnant....and laughing very hard......
Her future is the Doctors past. So it's most likely a later life version of her.
Actually: her past is the Doctors future. The whole idea is that as the Doctor goes forward in time, River Song goes back in time. We saw River Songs death when the Doctor first met her, and she know of all their future encounters (apart from the Doctors Death....for some reason...). By logic, she hasn't witnessed the Pandorica open yet - therefore does not have the time-jumper. At least...that's how its was MEANT to go....
And if her time-line is actually completely random: then I dont think anyone in the world will be able to understand this plot-point.
Last edited by Max Butcher (May 1, 2011 (02:03am))
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